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Bachmann's Angry Mob
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The gray-haired curiosity-seekers assembled by the Tea Party’s Wonder Woman, Michele Bachmann, in D.C. are part of the GOP purge that plays well on cable TV. But the the party’s not ready to face its biggest threat.
The gathering of Tea Party sorts on Capitol Hill to hear Michele Bachmann and other Republican celebrities speak harshly about speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi appears as harmless as kite-flying, until you listen closely and hear the familiar obsessed sounds of cultists and cranks chanting, “Kill the bill! Kill the bill!”
From the podium, Minority Leader John Boehner and Minority Whip Eric Cantor contributed trite trash-talk about the pending health-care reform vote in the House, but it was left to the Wonder Woman of the Tea Party, Michele Bachmann (R-MN), to cry out the over-the-top rhetoric that was cheered regardless of its incoherence: “You came. And you came to your house. And you came for an emergency house call. Are they going to listen? Oh, yeah, oh, yeah, they’re going to listen. It was Thomas Jefferson who said a revolution every now and then is a good thing. What do you think?”
The Bachmann star turn followed another Election Day in which the party out of power showed that it has fallen so far from reason that it can celebrate another loss of a House seat.
At noon on a workday in D.C., the 10,000 elderly, unemployed, retired curiosity-seekers, carrying creative signs such as “No!” were not a revolution, nor even the “rebellion” that Boehner claimed he saw. They were gray-haired props for more of the same posturing by what is left of the GOP on the Hill—a collection of clumsy self-promoters, talk show whiners, and impotent pols like Bachmann, as the GOP slips into the grave of a splinter party, undecipherable, unelectable, unmourned.
The Bachmann star turn—a Republican wag remarked, “Only in the insanity of politics could she be regarded as sane and hot”—followed another Election Day in which the party out of power showed that it has fallen so far from reason that it can celebrate another loss of a House seat.
Within hours of the completely unnecessary defeat in the New York 23rd, a result of the sabotage of the Club for Growth and its hirelings, there were chest-thumping boasts from the online precincts of National Review and RedState that a loss is as good as a win, that the true believers had raised up to smite the treacherous turncoat Dede Scozzafava in order to renovate the GOP.
The fact that the party had lost a seat it had held for a century, the fact that the Democrats has just gained another vote and that the GOP was going backward, was not much discussed during the inspired blame-shifting. Rush Limbaugh—who handed the Democrats a rallying point on election eve by smearing Scozzafava with the vulgar pun that she was “guilty of bestiality” with the RINOs (Republicans In Name Only)—blamed the Republican Party “bosses” for picking Scozzafava in the first place, without a primary. It is unclear if Limbaugh is ignorant about what a special election means—that is, a swift general vote to fill an empty seat in Congress—or if it was just inconvenient for him to check his script.
The insipid GOP chairman, Michael Steele, blamed Scozzafava for endorsing the Democratic candidate, Bill Owen. Steele did not answer why he did not call Scozzafava after she dropped out on Saturday morning and appeal to her to endorse conservative Doug Hoffman. Steele did acknowledge that the White House and Albany Democrats such as Attorney General Andrew Cuomo and Assembly Speaker Sheldon Silver did telephone Scozzafava and persuade her to endorse their side. Again, it is unclear if Steele is ignorant about his role as chairman of all the political voices of the party, especially those who are the party’s nominee with a name on the ballot, or perhaps Steele is just covering up that he feels intimidated by right-wing raconteurs like RedState’s Erick Erickson. Steele’s claim that the party will “get the seat back next year” sounds like the glib agent in the rock ‘n’ roll satire This Is Spinal Tap who rationalized the band’s shrinking audiences by arguing “their appeal is getting more selective.”
• Benjamin Sarlin: Bringing Down BachmannThe Club for Growth, wiping off the dagger it drove into the Republican candidate Scozzafava’s back, blamed the Republicans in general for picking anyone but a true conservative. What does true conservative mean to the Club for Growth’s Daddy Warbucks, Jackson Stephens, who paid lavishly to purge Scozzafava, to prop up the clueless Hoffman? In this case, a true conservative resembles someone who can imitate, without smirking, Ayn Rand’s cartoon heroes in Atlas Shrugged, “the Children of Light”: supermen and superwomen who will emerge from their mountain hideaway to rebuild America once the leftists, New Dealers, socialists, and One-Worlders have smashed it up. The Club for Growth may be impatient for the final days in the Republican Party, because immediately after ransacking the 23rd and giving Mrs. Pelosi another vote for health care, the same enthusiasts turned their garbled libertarian hokum against the Senate campaign of Gov. Charlie Crist in Florida, who is judged to be a RINO or, in the cultish parlance of the initiated, insufficiently unelectable.
After Hoffman’s defeat, Newt Gingrich, who supported Scozzafava as electable in Rockefeller New York, sounded like a wounded possum when he measured the damage that the snobs, barkers, and paranoids are doing in their purge of the Republican Party. Gingrich pointed out that of 39 House seats in New England, the Republican genius at intolerant and insensitive campaigning had now achieved two House members left to the caucus. “Don’t undervalue the last representative,” he tried, appealing for moderation and compromise, “don’t undervalue the last senator, to create a majority.” Where did this newly responsible Gingrich come from, you may puzzle, except as a reaction to the old Gingrich, model for the new new right?
It is too late for Gingrich’s tardy appeal to reach the ears of the suicide belt operation of the RNC, where Steele even now thinks it is his job to threaten those who live in moderate or liberal districts. The scripted carnival of Bachmann is the part of the purge that plays well on cable TV—exuberant seniors, flag-sporting patriots, freshly minted Thomas Jefferson scholars. The killer contract work of the Club for Growth and its kindred of Cain among the conspiracy-minded is the part that will keep Republicans frantic minority of crybabies, rereading Ayn Rand, yearning for America to fail like them.
John Batchelor is radio host of the John Batchelor Show in New York, Washington, D.C., San Francisco, and Los Angeles.
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Purge, baby, purge!
This comment has been removed by The Daily Beast's editors.
I am really getting sick and tired of these conservative Republicans calling themselves Libertarians. They are not. Libertarians are socially liberal. More so than many liberal Democrats. These Republicans are only toying with a specific set of fiscally conservative Libertarian ideals. Do not be fooled. If you don't know who Ludwig von Mises was, you're probably not a Libertarian, or fiscally conservative, for that matter.
They can talk about certain Ayn Rand principles, but as soon as you mention that she was an Atheist, and had a relationship with a married man, they'll go running for the hills.
So, do not be fooled when John Boner holds up a copy of the Constitution and spews out Libertarian ideals. He is just as much a threat to it as are the Socialist Left.
well said
Wonderful post! I would bet most of these Tea Baggers are just "ultra conservative" Christians, who would prefer a theocracy to our democracy.
You would lose your money.
I don't think optimistic would be losing any money. The Tea Baggers are just sheep being led to protest against their own best interest just like they are led to be swindled on Sundays in their megachurches for Jesus. It does say that Jesus liked 6 dollar expressos while at temple, though.
I'd get in on that bet too...easy money! Hey Gameon, if you're trying to protect a group of hypocrites because you find youself among them on Sundays, don't bother. Most educated folks know that christians are maggots who see themselves as morally and, in this case, ethnically superior. There's nothing more pathetic than a group of adults who yell for freedom in the same breath that they pray to a homicidal and mysogynistic supreme being.
DanKenton - "Most educated folks know that christians are maggots who see themselves as morally and, in this case, ethnically superior."
Congratulations on your knowledge about 'most' educated folks. Have you met them all personally or is this from an article in "Educated Folks Illustrated Monthly"?
Just an opinion, but I suspect you neither know 'most' educated folks or even 'most' Christians, and instead are expressing an opinion based on what you have seen of some of them, chiefly the ones that show up in the news and perhaps a bad experience with some of the hypocrites.
What AlwaysOptimistic is describing is a type of 'Christian' that I doubt Christ (just a man version or Son of God version) would recognize as one of his own, but rather just another form of the Pharisee hypocrites he was quite familiar with during his time on Earth.
I'm a Christian (most of the time, except when I have impure thoughts about evolution and the physical construction of the multiverse) and I dread the thought of a theocracy.
Religion in power, as implemented by people who should have a deep understanding about their own failings, is always a bad idea that leds to murder in great or small numbers, and corrupts everything it touches.
The Tea Baggers would find great comfort in having their present day fears removed from them by the certainties to be provided by a religious dictatorship, but their children would groan under the yoke, and their grandchildren would overthrow it.
Wow ,a lot of psychopathic hate from peace loving liberals?
gameon - Self-righteous and the attendant emotions are not the monopoly of any particular faith or anti-faith.
gameon - 'Self-righteous' should be 'Self-righteousness'. My anticipation about the episode of Hercule Poirot coming up on PBS at 10:00 have me distracted.
Hey whip your post is level headed,what I have a problem with is people who imply being christian automatically means your a lunatic extremist.That stereotype is used to discredit honest arguements against Gov. spending as voiced by the tea partygoers.It's the lazy persons way to respond to a challenge.
The teaparty promotes adherance to the constitution ,not a theocracy.People making things up out of thin air is just alittle annoying.
gameon - At the same time I am willing to believe that some of these have run into ugly 'christians'. So I don't take it personal. And some equate to ugly 'christians' in terms of self-righteous. And then a few are reaction trolls.
gameon - I don't think the tea baggers are strict constitutionalists. I suspect they would use government to push a social agenda perhaps in line with a Norman Rockwell version of Christianity, but very much out of sync with the ministry of Jesus as he lived it. These people see the Rockwell version of America vanishing, and it's scary and threatening to them, so they are reacting.
It's sad that they react this way, but America is always changing. Not always for the better, but always changing. Trying to go back to a golden age or move forward to one, something which all belief systems seem to have - political ones and religious ones, is a quest that is looking for something that never existed.
I would rather be a Christian living in Babylon than one living in a Christian quasi-theocracy, which just doesn't work any more than the noble though unrealistic idea of Communism worked in the real world. And as far as I can tell, I am in Babylon.
If they want to change America then they should love their neighbor as they love themselves, and follow God's commandments. People that actually do that get attention and respect even from unbelievers.
See you around.
Religion promotes charity and supporting ones neighbor.A huge amount of good deeds are done through christian churches.Syracuse Univ. put out a study saying that conservative christians give much more to charity than liberals tend to by a large percentage.I believe it, when's the last time you saw an Atheist soup kitchen?I personally have done work at a convent which is run by nuns to give shelter to women in abusive situations,this would be gone in a "religion free world".
I personally do not practice any religion,but to pretend that our culture and heritage aren't based on christian values is wrong.It has been the rudder on our American ship for a long time and was what strengthened us during trying times.Trying to hold on to ones culture and traditions is important and in no way makes someone an evil person,not that you're saying that.
This country has done more good for the human race than any country that has ever existed,and it was all done under the banner of christian ideals,take that away and who knows what we're left with.
Or when John Boehner holds up a copy of the Constitution and then quotes the Declaration of Independence.
Did anyone else think it was awkward that he was trying to emphasis the "Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness" part and was clueless that the first right listed is 'Life?" Seems to me that if you have an inalienable right to Life having health care coverage for all would be the main way to ensure that right.
You don't have a right to anything that infringes on the rights of others. You Socialists need to crawl back under the rock of historical disasters that you slimmed your way out of!
Oh escomments... if you only understood history... and economics and politics.
You are actually pathetic. Nowhere in either document does it claim health services are an entitlement. The United States was founded on the principal of each man providing for himself, not getting what you want because you yell about it for long enough.
redlotus2 - "You are actually pathetic. Nowhere in either document does it claim health services are an entitlement. The United States was founded on the principal of each man providing for himself, not getting what you want because you yell about it for long enough."
redlotus2 is correct. 'Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness' (which really means being allowed to take a chance with fortune) as the founders had in mind was all about having the freedom to live your own life to the best of your ability, without interference from either the government or any kind of state church. This is the 'pursuit of happiness' in the meaning of the time.
Of course, that also included the freedom to own other people as property, one of the reason some of the founding fathers were quite enthusiastic about splitting away from the British, who were slowly building up to the abolition of the slave trade and slavery itself, hence the need for independence and its declaration by the slaver class.
Not that it matters what the founders thought, since they are all dead and we the living decide what it means. If we decide that health maintenance is part of what we call 'life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness', then that is indeed what it means. Though obviously we're not in agreement about that.
redlotus2: I actually agree with our founders - women such as Sarah Palin and Michelle Bachmann should not be allowed to vote.
I'm okay with most of the rest voting, though.
The United States was not founded on the principal of each man providing for himself. It was founded on free people coming together to make a society better than what they had experienced coming from Europe where there lives were ruled over by a non-elected royalty and church dogma.
If the United States were founded on every man for themselves, they wouldn't have bothered to form a government at all, would they have?
How feking stupid are some people?
meglon978 - "every man for themselves" is a bit different than "each man providing for himself". The first sounds like the order to abandon ship, and the second is mostly what we have today, in terms having to find a job to earn an income to live on and pay taxes on, etc, with some of those taxes going to provide for the others.
John Boehner was actually reciting from the Declaration of Independence. I guess he gets the 2 confused.
And the whole group around him was nodding in agreement! That pocket size copy of the Constitution that he carries must have different words than the one the rest of us read. It's frightening that all those Congressmen didn't seem to know the difference!
You Reps are so afraid that some of the taxpayer monies will be used to help American citizens. But you never complain about these monies being used for WAR, which you love. It makes you feel STRONG AND MANLY I guess. And Aland2;s remark about women and the vote was unfunny and sexist.
newswoman: I'm sexist because I don't want a few crazy conservative women to vote? There are a lot of crazy conservative men I wouldn't allow to vote too if I could manage it.
Now the conservatives who say that no women at all should be allowed to vote (and I've heard a few of them say this) - that's real sexism.
Humor is in the eye of the reader, and I'm sorry you took offense. But after all, this is the DB, and my humor is usually pretty mild compared to a number of posters here.
Fatboy, who said everyone in that crowd was a Libertarian? YOU?
The people in those crowds are the melting pot we call America...who just doesn't happen to agree with you and your views. It looks like they are getting to you as you all sit in your basements in your pajamas spewing hate and disgust, when at least they are out there doing something about what they believe in
This is America, not Iran, Cuba or any of those socialist countries yet, even though Obama's health Care is right out of the book, Rules for Radicals, by Saul alinski his mentor and bible...Go read that people and then you will understand why the unemployment is 10.2% after a porkulus bill was to keep it at 8%...
I think it's great you believe all his lies, so in 2010 the Congress will be republican again, and the almighty leader will be scratching his head, it can't be because I passed all those expensive bills could it?
diamondgirl: Yes, this is America! That why we have taken months to work on a health care bill that the republicans will support. Senator Grasseley was one of the republicans in the committee. After getting the Democrats to throw out everything he didn't like, he said he wouldn't support the bill. He even went on the stump and told his constituents, they have every right to fear, and this was the bill he worked on for months. This not about a government take over, this is about the republicans trying to get back in power. And they are not above spewing the hate and the fear,or at the very least reminding silent because they see it as an advantage that the issues not be discussed. Health care reform has been delayed for months as fallacies about it are still being refuted. Senator Demint said They will make health care reform this Presidents "Waterloo" There is a democratic progress taking place in Washington, inspite all the claims of socialism and government take over.
so pathetically short sighted...
Melting pot? Melting pot!? Are you serious? I think everyone in those crowds are essentially cookie cutter images of Fox News watching gullible people that listen to fear mongers like Bachmann and Boner.
As we spew hate and disgust? Like signs about burying Health Care with Ted Kennedy? You are in your own little right-wing world of reactivity. That's all you do, react to any type of change. No ideas, no compromise. Their idea of bipartisanship is "do what we want to do, and we'll call it bipartisan."
You like to scare people and take them back to the Reagan days of Communist Russia, and the Nixon days of Maoist China; no. By your standards the Swedes, are Socialists. They have Universal Health Care; some of the healthiest and most intelligent people on the planet. And they are ranked first in the world by The Economist's Democracy Index. Now, I am not saying that we should become a Socialist nation, what I am saying is stop using words in a "creative" and manipulative fashion to drive angry herds of people who probably benefit from this government more than they care to know. Diamondgirl, I think you should leave the TV set and look outside. If these crowds ae a melting pot to you, I have some advice: leave; leave as quickly as possible and don;t look back.
You are so bitter. Your comments are so angry. I hope you have health insurance because you're going to suffer from hypertension soon if you aren't already.
Diamond girl
your the problem go back to school, when you were there you were not paying attention, Cuba is a communist country the other side of the political spectrum of socialism,and Iran is a theocrasy
We need Mort Saul back with his blackboard to explain political spectrum
diamondgirl:
Thank you. I just keep forgetting that when the republicans ran Congress, everything was, well..absolutely perfect! There was no deficit, no trillion dollar wars, no discord of any kind. It really was freakin Shangrila, wasnt it? Thnaks for reminding me of that.
Diamondgirl...did you say the people in the crowds were the "melting pot" of America...Get out of here!!! Keith Olbermann was even commenting on how the tea baggers would do them self some good by getting a few brown, black, Asian or Hispanics to join them...I keep saying they look EXACTLY like the fat, old, angry, white mobs that tried to stop integration....
diamondgirl,
In case you didn't know this, the US is a Socialist country. It has been since 1913. Do you know what happened in 1913? I'll give you a hint: It has to do with a bank.
skibummin1-
Go back to school? Communism is the opposite of Socialism?
What school did you go to?
Karl Marx, was the father of modern Socialism.
Cuba is a Marxist/leninist state. Please do some research before spouting off with such idiocy!
FatFreddy-
If you are referring to the Federal Reserve Act, I wouldn't call that the start of the Socialist State.
Try 1937, nlrb v. jones laughlin steel corp.
This is in fact when Socialism Started in this Country thanks to FDR.
And he did it by causing a Constitutional Crises!
Progressives as far back as the 1930s have been attacking the Constitution to seek greater Government Control over the populace.
Melting Pot? Ha, ha! If that's true, shouldn't there be at least one brown-skinned person there? It's a Fake News contrived "crackpot", that's what it is. And those "expensive bills" are necessary if we are to continue to pay out all those social security and medicare payments those socialist-hating, melting-pot, "real" americans demand!
I would disagree. Technically,you could go back even further to February 25, 1791. The first and foremost definition of Socialism is central planning of the economy (controlling the money supply), which is the primary function of the Federal Reserve. FDRs New Deal was more Corporatist than Socialist. Corporatism is something that is shared by both Republicans and Democrats.
DeeAmbro-
Are you trying to say that you know everyone who was there and can with out a doubt stipulate that there was not one brown skin person?
FatFreddy-
That was Hamilton's idea.
My least favorite Founding Father.
escomment: So, if Dee-Ambro or any other was there and found one brown skin person, One would prove what?
escomments, in all the pictures of teabagger events, I've seen maybe two people that weren't angry white people. I know teabaggers don't like facts, but the facts are that this country is changing demographically and when you hang a "whites only" sign on the door of the republican party, don't be surprised when everyone else votes for the other party. You'll see.
DeeAmbro
escomments, in all the pictures of teabagger events, I've seen maybe two people that weren't angry white people. I know teabaggers don't like facts, but the facts are that this country is changing demographically and when you hang a "whites only" sign on the door of the republican party, don't be surprised when everyone else votes for the other party. You'll see.
Nobody's hung a "Whites only" sign anywhere!
What are you trying to say?
They don't pass your test?
Angry White People?
Are you an angry Black person?
I don't know, I'm asking.
So what if there was one or two. I don't know, I wasn't there and frankly don't care if there was 5 or 500!
That's the difference between Liberals and Conservatives. Conservatives truly are Color Blind while Liberals are always watching the crowds to see how many people of this race, or that race are out there. As if that proves something.
Seventeen replies.
I think you hit a nerve, diamondgirl. Congratulations.
escomments, my point is that the teabaggers are a very narrow segment of America and not at all representative of the population at large. What are they so afraid of? They're angry and "want their country back" but back to what? We're moving ahead...get out of the way! They seem to hate everybody...muslims, hispanics, liberals, gays, jews, immigrants, democrats, oh I could go on and on. BTW, didn't Jesus say to love one another? They claim to be christian, yet hate everyone else. That doesn't win elections.
escomments: said "That's the difference between liberals and conservatives. Conservatives truly are color blind while liberals are always watching the crowd to see how many people of this race or that race are out there, As if that proves something". You can't really claim to be color blind while all the evidence suggests otherwise. A crowd of 99% white does prove something. On the republican party web site they are bragging about Jackie Robinson being a great republican. I guess they forgot what Robinson said. " Every chance I got , while I was campaining, I said plainly what I thought of the right wing republicans and the harm they were doing. I felt the GOP was a minority party in terms of the number of registered voters and could not win unless they updated their social philosoply and sponsored candidates and principals to attract the young,the black and the independent voter"......That was in 1964, not much has changed.
Diamondgirl, you are totally full of it. The people in those crowds carried posters of Holocaust victims to simulate the people on the healthcare rolls, if the bill is passed, and other posters depicting our President in unflattering ways. This is hate speech and if these people are just the melting pot of America, we've gone terribly astray.
DeeAmbro
"escomments, my point is that the teabaggers are a very narrow segment of America and not at all representative of the population at large. What are they so afraid of? They're angry and "want their country back" but back to what? We're moving ahead...get out of the way! They seem to hate everybody...muslims, hispanics, liberals, gays, jews, immigrants, democrats, oh I could go on and on. BTW, didn't Jesus say to love one another? They claim to be christian, yet hate everyone else. That doesn't win elections."
I really don't think you have a clue what "Teabaggers" are.
It is so simplistic for the Left to just label these people Teabaggers, or Racists, or People who hate! I guess in their minds, it's a good way to marginalize them and try to render them ineffective but really all it does is fill them with all the more resolve and determination to defeat the Liberals who are on a path to destroying this country!
We are not moving ahead. We are moving to a system of Government that has been proven to be a failure through out history. So we are actually moving backwards!
I certainly don't love Muslims who are strapping on bombs and blowing up Innocent people or flying planes into buildings. As a matter of fact I think they are freekin' animals that need to be put down. Do I paint all Muslims with that brush? Not necessarily but I do think that their religion is inherently evil and so do most other non Muslim people around the world. They just won't say it for fear of either the PC police or the fact that they may get their heads chopped off or blown up.
Liberals, It's pretty obvious that I have a dislike for liberals because they are such busy buddies. They are trying to run everyone's lives where most people just want to be left alone.
I have no problem with Hispanics if they are here legally. I have a dislike of ones that are not here legally and more contempt for the Liberals who support them being here illegally.
No problem with Immigrants as long as they assimilate into the American culture. That culture that hasn't been destroyed by multiculturalism and the Left's attack on traditional values. Another reason for disliking Liberals.
I think that Homosexuality is disgusting. I personally don't care what people do behind closed doors but I will never agree to normalizing it into the culture as many states are finding out. People are not in support of Gay Marriage.
The only problem I have with most Jews in America is that they are Liberals. I am Jewish and I have a huge issue with Jews who won't support Israel and actually support policies against Israel. They have fallen for the cesspool of Left wing Propaganda to the elimination of their own race and religion in favor of Muslims who want to sweep them into the sea.
Amazing.
Oh yeah, and then there are the Liberals who try to point out the hypocrisy of Christians by saying that Jesus tells us to love our enemies. So we should take that to mean that we should support people who are trying to kill us or destroy our way of life.
That begs the question, to what end?
I guess that's what you meant.
I don't have the mental disorder that is the Liberal mindset. It is truly the definition of insanity
stjam8-
Republicans?
Those people aren't Republicans.
They are Libertarians and Conservatives. Something Republicans stopped supporting shortly after 1994
Well, escomments, if they're not republicans why is the republican party embracing them? And if you are Jewish, then I hope you are appalled at the "National Socialist Healthcare" sign with a picture of naked Dachau concentration camp victims on it. There were several more anti-semitic signs seen at the rally. So please excuse a person if one were to assume that that means...Jews aren't very well liked by this mob. And as far as homosexuality is concerned, this is just my humble opinion, but in my travels I've noticed that those that scream the loudest about it wind up being closeted homosexuals after all. Not that that applies to you, it's just something I've noticed. If we would just live and let live, maybe we could address some real problems. Imagine that, talking about issues that truly affect people's lives rather than hot-button issues that politicians want us to fight over while they steal all the money?
DeeAmbro-
I don't have time for this anymore. You've got nothing.
DeeAmbro said,
"And as far as homosexuality is concerned, this is just my humble opinion, but in my travels I've noticed that those that scream the loudest about it wind up being closeted homosexuals after all."
I think this observation applies nowhere more clearly than it does to people who call other people "teabaggers".
Most of us had no idea what "teabagging" was until the Democrats' shills in the corporate media began using the term, with smiles and winks, to describe tax protestors last Spring.
I heard that it was a reference to some sort of sexual practice, but it wasn't until a few weeks ago that I finally learned what it was. Then it struck me: The term is a perfect metaphor for the corporate media who slobber over Obama and the Democrats.
So, RomeoHotel, what is the lesson to be learned from that? Put on a thinking cap, do a little research, turn off Rush and Fake News and learn to do a little thinking for yourselves. A simple google search might have turned up that embarrassing little detail. But like everything else in your lives, you'd rather blame it on the democrats. Pathetic.
Exactly. If they really want to liken themselves to Ayn Rand characters, shouldn't they be hiding in a mountain somewhere and not in the nation's capital?
So you are totally shocked that the people, senior citizens who all receive the public option,(medicare) are the only group who oppose the rest of our population being offered the public option in heathcare. Further you actually expect members of congress to understand our Constitution wow what a novel concept!! BTW wasn't Alan Greenspan one of Ayn Rands lovers i wonder if he had those liver spots then.
And don't forget the republican politicians. They also get a great medical plan and oppose the rest of us having the same. Hypocrites!
MIchele Bachmann Supremacist. She is inciting unstable people to be violent as we have witnessed in the past day and a half. She hides behind this Republican violent speech making which is totally irresponsible for a congresswoman. What motivates this "congresswoman" is a Supremacist hatred for anyone who is not white and is the President of the US. How did she ever get elected?
FatFreddy - I am socially liberal but at the same time fiscally conservative. But I don't know who Ludwig von Mises is, even though Wikipedia is a few key strokes away. Does that mean I can't say I am a Libertarian? I do know who Harry Browne is.
Minority Leader John Boehner is a proto-fascist and if indeed the Constitution was a 'living' document it would have felt soiled by his touch.
Well said, Whip. Our country would be a better place if Boehner and a few other ultra-conservative Republicans retired. Too bad so many of them come from safe districts...
Poor Robert Welch. Ahead of his time.
Pathetic.
Looks like Tea Bagger head honcho Bachmann is one up on Palin for the moment but, not to fear, Palin will get back the upper hand with book promotion appearances. Cat fight in the offing? Stay tuned.
Teabaggers purging the teabaggers. Iol
Bachmann is like Palin, only without all the brains.
What brains, NHBobWhen speaking without notes she is incoherent.
"until you listen closely and hear the familiar obsessed sounds of cultists and cranks chanting,"
I would emphasize the word cultists. I've been saying that the teabaggers resemble a cult. Glad to see someone agrees with me.
Do mobs of glazed eyed Obamanites also remind you of a cult ?What about mobs of angry anti-war protestors?How about gay rallies? Or groups of grey-bearded pro-gov. health care supporters?What about labor unions?
Silly liberals,you're on the wrong side of history!Do any of you have any actual level headed arguments or do you only have the ability to stereotype and use simple minded terms like"angry mob','cultists','tea-baggers'',wingnuts".
Spin how you like,nobody is buying it.
Silly neocon, you fail to see the irony in your statement. You are stereotyping us "silly libs" as stereotypers. I could use some cliche about a pot and a kettle, but I'm sure it would be lost on you. Your argument is tired -- and in fact, no one is buying it.
gameon: "What about labor unions?" Without the strong labor movement in this country, Most Americans would be working 2 or more jobs without health care benefits. Oh, my mistake, that was 30 years ago, before the working class were successfully villainfied by big business. "How about "gay rallies?" So, You are against CIVIL RIGHTS? "Health care supporters" This group of people includes doctors nurses and medical providers. The latest group to support health care reform is the AARP. "Angry anti-war protesters" So people who are protesting the war are lumped in to one big cult with the rest of the people you have singled out. There is a lot of reasons to protest the war. If we are going to stay in these countries, are our methods effective, or creating more of the same. For every dead terrorists we can point to, 2 or more spring up. "Silly Liberal, your're on the wrong side of history! Do any of you have any actual level headed arguments or do you have the ability to sterotype and use simple minded terms like "angry mobs",cultists, tea-baggers, wingnuts". The republicans remain silent as they let these people speak for them, instead of getting involved in the democratic process. These people you mention at the end have no level headed arguments, but have been riled up by the GOP looking to get back in power. They talk about socialism and government take over.hilter, mao,etc. We need be discussing the issues like health care reform , job creation, climate change. Less rectoric and more discussions on the issues is important at this time in our history.
Supporting thr President makes us "Cultists"? And anti-war protesters are a good thing. They stopped the Viet Nam war. We need them to march again so we can get out of Afghanistan. We haven't had enough grey-bearded pro-gov. health care supporters, either. And labor unions are dead, mostly, but you Reps can't forget SEIU (maids, waiters, etc.) as tho' they were the strongest union in the country. Grow up and stop being afraid of new ideas and new ways of doing things. You will survive.
Among the many Leftie delusions I've encountered, one of the weirdest is the one that postulates that, as "newswoman" puts it, the Left is a fount of "new ideas".
That's insane, and here's an easy way to prove it.
What was the last "new idea" from the Left? Nationalized health care? They've been pushing that since at least the 1940s. Same sex marriage? Since at least the 1960s. Anything else?
The newest Leftwing idea that I can think of was the municipal income tax.
Meanwhile, the Right has come up with the idea of individualized retirement accounts, vouchers for education, ... heck, even the Republicans "Medicare Part D" was pretty imaginative (and popular and the only government medical program ever to cost less than projected!)
The Left is the home of the dead ideas. Zombie ideas. That Lefties think they are "outside the box thinkers" would be hilarious if it weren't so harmful to themselves and society.
btw, newswoman: You can't both "support the President" AND want us "to get out of" the war he called "a necessary war".
Good grief,you people need to get a grip.Calling a group of people who are for low taxes and adherence to the constitution a "cult" is an intellectually lazy and pathetic way to try an discredit a group who has legitimate complaints and fears.
What I was implying earlier was that to saddle the teaparty as extremists is the exact same thing that happens to labor unions,war protests,etc. Legitimate groups that may have legitimate complaints that should be dealt with in an intellectually honest way,not discounted with political propaganda.Liberals just so happen to love name calling ,as 8 years of Bush bashing showed us. Liberals also love to group the people by races and class.The Democratic party is the home of stereotyping and namecalling.
You guys just don't like the taste of your own medicine.
Also, most Libertarians are against interfering with the inner workings of established foreign governments, and are against the war in Iraq, the war in Afghanistan, torture, enhanced interrogation, and believe in due process of law for all detainees. Run that by them and see how they react. And most Libertarians are pro-choice.
So I guess the choice for Libertarians is do they want a lighter hand from the Federal Government in the economy or on international affairs? It's the economy for me and I would imagine for most other Libertarian-minded people as well.
Scozzafava was not challenged because of her views on abortion or gay marriage -- it was because of supporting the stimulus, card check, etc. She was neither a social conservative nor an economic conservative and she was simply in the wrong party.
Why should it be one or the other? The two are not incompatible.
That may very well be, but I try not to get involved in other state's elections.
And as for the "choice", there is no choice. There are Libertarians, and there are libertarians. As for the people in the crowd, do you really think any of them have any idea what Objectivism is, or Austrian Economics? Do you think Boner or Bachman do?
Grimmace: It sounds to me like Scozzafava was challenged because she put good for her country ahead of good for the Republican Party.
In other words, she was a true American.
The drift from reality has accelerated. It won't be long before Bachman is calling for liberal internment camps just like her fascist predecessors
You better hide Konchster. Die Fuhrer Bachman is looking for you!
It has long been known that Bachmann is certifiable. But her crazy rants and raves are music to the ears of the Tea Bagging fools, who unwittingly act on behalf of the healthcare insurance industry, who currently overcharge them and would deny their claim on a specious "pre-existing condition" in a heart beat.
And what can you say about Bachmann's accomplices to fraud? Boehner quoted the Declaration of Independence and claimed he was quoting the U.S. Constitution. Cantor was equally dissembling.
America has some serious problems. It's unfortunate we have a Republican Party that is out fomenting, ignorant mobs, and spreading lies, rather than be a constructive force for America's future.
"In this case, a true conservative resembles someone who can imitate, without smirking, Ayn Rand's cartoon heroes in Atlas Shrugged, "the Children of Light": supermen and superwomen who will emerge from their mountain hideaway to rebuild America once the leftists, New Dealers, socialists, and One-Worlders have smashed it up."
That sounds alot like Charles Manson's vision for Helter Skelter. Maybe he was a fan of Ayn Rand. He and Greenspan should get together and discuss...:-)
Scary. Extremists are very scary..
I don't mean to say that the halls of Congress are necessarily sacrosanct, nor do I believe it's existence is so vaunted that it should be revered as some sort of unassailable "Mount Olympus" of governance, but where does this crackpot woman get off inciting a mass assault?
Is she in fact attempting to bring about a real pitch fork and torch type revolution? Is she writing a screen play? When is this movie due for release?
The "Irresponsible Ire of the Irrelevant" is beyond the bounds of sanity, at this point. They're creating an alternative fact base, and using it to create an alternate perception, of an altered reality. It is just monumentally brain scrambling.
You add to that the feckless MSM and the FOX NEWS echo chamber, and what they are doing is making it almost impossible to have the true facts, on any given issue, reasonably weighed and discussed.
If this is allowed to continue, they will successfully not only burn the Houses of government the Democrats inhabit, but also themselves.
We're all in the same boat. Do they not realize that?
No answer to that is required. The answer is evident.
I agree! It's frightening and getting out of hand. I read that she and her husband own a group of mental health clinics in Minnesota.
A true example of going with your strengths.
Kind of like a plumber owning a company that makes toilets.
I can't begin to tell you how darkly humorous that little factoid is.
I thank you for the laugh.
As you can see the good people of the Minnesota 6th district have been hijacked by the total wackjob Bachmann. Please free us by supporting Tarryl Clark for Congress. Go to www.tarrylclark.com for more information on her views.
It sounds like failed radio talk host Batchelor is jealous tyke. Add the 20,000 to the 1.3 million 912'ers in DC, the Fullerton, Ca 15,000, TWICE, and a host of other huge numbers, not reported by the MSM of ordinary Americans voicing the policies of this failed administration and you have America being taken back from the radical jihad progressives. Say what you want, your just losers all the way around your circle jerk.
Many elections were lost by the progressive movement this past week. NY23 was held by democrats until 1993 when redistricting gave it to the gop, so much for your civil war spin. 23 will come back to the gop with the full force of an election includes primaries next year. However deep blue Westchester County, NY was lost forever to the democratics on Tuesday as were many across the country not reported by MSM.
The crafty language and personnel attacks are all you have left and it's not fooling anyone anymore.
You say: Many elections were lost by the progressive movement this past week...
And:
However deep blue Westchester County, NY was lost forever to the democratics on Tuesday as were many across the country not reported by MSM.
I ask:
Such as?
And:
Now admit it, when you talk about circle jerks your mouth waters just a little, doesn't it?
Are you an under-study for Dennis Miller?
'Cause you're really funny! Mentally challenged, but funny.
Truth sucks for you. stop reading comic books as news and learn some recorded facts
So then you aren't going to give me examples? That's all I was asking for.
And what's wrong with comic books? I'd think "Witchfinder" would especially appeal to far right Republican purists.
There is no big tent for the gop. It's called principals that make the difference. Too bad only a few repubs and dems have them
I believe the conservatives need to be careful with these tea parties. I believe it was a smart tool in the beginning to amp up the base to make sure they are still alive, but the moderates and independents will get sick of this after a while. I believe if health care passes along with cap and trade then the Democrats will seal their fate without the help of screaming people on capital hill. We need for our country to somehow come together instead of separating more and more.
Since FoxNews and the GOP seem to be instrumental in organizing these 'grassroots' TEABagging protests, aren't they technically 'astroturf' now?
Bachmann,
keeps getting funnier and funnier, his over use of big words and hype to gloss over the truth to prove his point, even if its contradicts facts.
Where is his pointed thinking when it comes to NJ, who hasn't had a Republican Governor in how long, and who had the President come to 5 rallies and out spent his opponent 3 to 1. Or how about VA?
As for Scozzafava, the roster came home to roost. She is a Republican in name only, her record and issues was what people didn't like about her plus her inability to raise money killed her chances. Instead of be gracious about not being able to drag her butt across the finish line, she showed her true liberal colors and endorsed the Democrat. WOW and people wonder why she dropped out.
As for his statements about the Tea Party, name another group that could get aprox 20,000 people to come to D.C. in a weeks notice? Or that they are "elderly, unemployed, retired curiosity-seekers", but didn't mention that they are Democrats(or are they Democrats in name only?), Republicans, Liberals, Conservatives, ECT.. All of these Tea Party folks have a couple of things in common, first the vote, and more importantly that don't want Obama Care.
In this country when the people stand up for what they believe in and rally in D.C. in protest to what our government is doing, instead of looking at the issues, these so called pundit, just want to brand, label and pigeon hole them so they can classify and hopefully degrade or destroy them.
Lastly, Pelosi's bill, all I have to say is go read that pile of rubbish and then make up your own mind. As for me I believe in health care reform, not Obama's one sided we know best and arent going to fix the problems but make more problems Health Care.
As someone once said if you need new tires on your car. you go get new tires, you don't go buy another car.
Remember to Vote 2010..........
Just a clarification: NJ last had an elected Republican governor from 1994-2001.
Also, how is someone who votes along party lines about 95% of the time considered a RINO? I am actually curious as to what your criteria are because I can't understand it. What, to you, makes someone a RINO?
surely you don't mean Scozzofava votes 95% along party lines?
Yes we did. Christie Whitman. She was forced out of the Bush administration after about 6 months. She was head of the EPA. She was the first victim of "The Purge".
Clearthinker says, "surely you don't mean Scozzofava votes 95% along party lines"?
According to Scozzofava that is precisely what she did. Maybe she lies...
Look how eager these libs.,including the writer, are to give up control of their lives to their FUHRER! You desperately need an all powerful Gov. to tell you how to live,work,play,raise your kids,what to eat,what to listen to or watch,oh,and how to take care of your health.I don't blame you,most of you were raised by good people perhaps,but you were never taught self-sufficiency,how to stand on your own.You feel that you "deserve" life,liberty and happiness".But in reality your just guaranteed the "pursuit" of those things.You feel so insecure about your lack of self-sufficiency that you classify tea-party people,which is a diverse group of people,as old crazy people.In reality tea-party people are business leaders,the working class and in general people who despise the mismanagement of their money.What's wrong with that?
I find it funny that the open minded,accepting, liberals on this site are the ones who do the most childish namecalling,stereotyping and give the most irrelevant counterpoints.I guess thats just the result of basing your politics on emotions,it leaves you high-and dry when it comes to backing up your arguments.
I guess this is just the obvious progression of the failed hippie culture,a whole generation of spoiled children who feel they're owed everything by "evil ,white,business people".Perhaps if more libs paid taxes they would start to feel the way I do.But you would have to actually get a job first!(smoking marijuana doesn't count as a job)
Real Americans question the government,we don't rely on it to live.
Big Brother is not my keeper!
Good luck with getting any kind of intellectual response to what you just said.
We should probably take bets on what names you will be called or how Racist, Bigoted, Homophobic, you must be to have such Intolerant views.
I like it!!
gameon: You call our President fuhrer in capitals, then in your next paragraph say the liberals are the first to use childish name calling. On second thought, I wouldn't call your name calling childish, but dangerous, to continuely refer to a democratically elected President as a dictator and a nazi This President has spent months trying to work with the republicans on many bills including the health care reform. As a hard working liberal that strongly believes in the work ethic and taking pride in one's work, The issue is not about government takeover. The insurance company that I have been paying premiums for decades, now requires from my doctor a written letters to verify that I need the drugs the doctor has prescribed for me and my family. So, I find it interesting that is a thing that the opposition warns about the goverment bureaucrat between you and your doctor. There is already someone between you and your doctor, an insurance employee. The issue is about affordable health care for all Americans. About actually getting the health care you have paid for. An investigation this summer by the House, Energy and Commerce Committee, and earlier ones by state regulators in California, New York and Connecticut, found that thousands of vulnerable and seriously ill policy holders have had their coverage canceled by many of the nations largest insurance companies without any legal basis. The Congressional committee found that 3 insurance companies alone made at least $300 million dollars in the last 5 years using rescission. Rescission is when insurance companies retroatively cancel your coverage based on alleged misstatements, sometimes after a diagnoses of a life threating disease. The following is from the Huffington Post 9/17/09. In Feb. 08 a private arbitration judge in Los Angles ordered Health Net Inc. to pay more then $9 million to a breast cancer patient whose health insurance it revoked shortly after her diagnoses and while she was under going chemotherapy. The plaintiff, Patsy Bates, a 52 year old grandmother and hair salon owner was unable to continue her chemotherapy for several months. During the case, evidence emerged that Health Net had paid bonuses to employees to reward them based on the number of policy holders they had recinded. The judge said in his decision " It is difficult to imagine a policy more reprehensible then trying bonuses to encourage the recission of health insurance that keeps the public well and alive".
What you just said about Insurance Companies is true! No arguments here! Consider it stipulated!
Your remediation to have the government take it over is wrong!
You don't take a burning grease fire and pore more grease on it!
That is the Liberal answer to the problem. It's a non answer, answer.
What the Liberals are trying to pass though congress costs more money, calls for individual mandates which are unconstitutional, is 2000 pages of un intelligible crap meant to do one thing, take over 1/6 of the US economy.
That is the end game. No argument can be made that would deny that would be the result.
The Government needs to remove antitrust exemptions from the insurance companies so they can't price fix.
The Government needs to force states to deregulate insurance companies so that they can compete across state lines. They have the actually meaning of the constitutional authority granted through the Interstate Commerce Clause, and the Full Faith and Credit Clause to do this.
The fact that Congress and the Obama Administration aren't discussing any of this and poo pooing anyone who brings it up speaks volumes about what is is they are really trying to do with Health Care Reform.
The Government needs to stop meddling in the economy and let businesses fail instead of using tax money to prop them up.
There needs to be free market incentives for the economy to come back, for the private sector to find free markets, expand and create jobs.
Obama needs to stop doing what he is doing and get his boot off the neck of free enterprise.
escomments - Congress is getting rid of the anti-trust exemption - it's in the bill.
The government is in no way shape or form taking over the health insurance industry - if only - other governments either through strong regulation or single payer have dramatically lower costs and better outcomes.
Getting rid of anti-trust solves the state regulation problem. It's because of the exemption that states had to regulate them.
escomments: arsty farsty addresses most of your comments. But the boot on free enterprise? So, even afer the the fisco on Wall Street last year, you advocating no regulations?
The fiasco on Wall Street. Wall Street has the government in their pockets! Wall Street is not free enterprise. Wall Street is an oligarchy, or haven't you figured that out yet.
When you have a revolving door between Goldman Sachs and Washington (administration of your choice) Larry Summers, Robert Rubin, Tim Geithner, you have complete and utter corruption. This administration is doing nothing to remediate it, in fact, this administration employes the same gang of Wall Street insiders that caused the meltdown in the first place as the "Experts" who are going to fix it.
ArtsyFartsy- If you think that the ultimate goal for the government is to supply Health Care coverage to the masses, then I have a bridge in Brooklyn for sale.
The states regulate Health Insurance companies to control the way individuals and businesses purchase Health Insurance within the state. Most of it is political pandering to special interests Mainly insurance companies that don't want to have to compete with other insurance companies. It has everything to do with why you can't purchase Health Insurance across state lines. There are individual state laws and regulation that bars doing business with Insurance Companies out side of your state.
I know that the bill in Congress does not address this issue. The Democrats don't support Insurance Companies having to compete with other Insurance Companies out side to their states. If they did, there would be no need for the so called "Public Option" to compete with private Insurance companies. The only LOGICAL reason left, and it is a stated goal of Barack Obama and other Progressives, for their non support of interstate commerce for Insurance Companies is the way Progressives are planning to take over the Health Insurance Industry. Thereby morphing into a single payer Government Controlled plan at the end of the day.
Then you also have to wonder why the hurry to pass this legislation when the actual insurance part of it doesn't take effect until 2013. Well after the re-election of Obama. Not before it.
Liberal politicians are so devious in their deception. None of the bills are going to be posted on line.
They lie about the intent of the legislation.
They lie about who will be covered.
They lie about how much it will cost.
They are despicable.
The only way to even start to convince people other wise would be that the law would state that everyone is entitled and will fall under the same Government Health Care Insurance plan that Congress is entitled to.
Of course when Joe Wilson brought up an amendment that would require that all of Congress had to live under this same legislation that was being crafted, he was soundly defeated.
The hypocrisy!
If congress doesn't have to live with the laws that they pass for everyone else, then screw them!
escomments: Wall Street is an Oligrarchy, but you don't think insurance and other big business is not? We still have the right to vote in this country, I have let my legislators know what I think about the Issues including health care reform. Have you? "Democrats don't support the insurance companies to compete". The Center for the Responsive Politics has a list of the republicans and bluedogs who have received money from the insurance and pharmaceutical companies. HURRY? Months have been spent trying to come up with a bill that the republicans and bluedogs would like, to no avail. Joe Wilson's bill about members of Congress having to take the Public Option, is funny, members of Congress already get government funded health care.
stjam8-
Is that all you've got?
Twaaaaaa.. The Bluedogs and the Repulicans take Insurance money.
News Flash. The Democrats took Insurance Money also.
SO WHAT!!
I don't care which party did what, they both suck.
You have no argument against the main point which is,
The State governments and the Insurance Companies have made pacts in each individual state to monopolize the industry for the 2 or 3 companies in each state and have barred other companies from out of state to do business.
I said Congress needs to break that up and allow insurance companies to compete across state lines.
The liberals in congress are flat out against that!
They don't want Insurance companies to be allowed to compete across state lines.
What's your answer to that?
Oh that's right. That's one of those points that I chose not to respond to.
escomments: This has been mentioned before, The McCarren-Ferguson Act of 1945 has allowed insurance companies to operate as a monopoly. When the GOP bring up the buying over state lines "red herring", they want the stricter state regulations removed. Bluedogs are democrats unless you perfer to call them dinos.
stjam8
You're killing me!
Red Herring? Of course they want the state regulations removed!
So they can COMPETE!
Isn't that the Liberal Buzz word of the day?
Isn't that what the Libs are bemoaning that there is no COMPETITION in the Insurance markets so we are going to fix it with a
government insurance company to COMPETE with private insurance companies in the form of a Public Option?
WTF?
escomment; So do you deliberately miss the point? Once again, The McCarran- Ferguson Act of 1945 allows insurance companies to act like a monoploy. Monopolies doen"t compete, they set prices. Some states have stricter regulations, that's their right. If the insurance companies want to do business in a state, they need to meet that states regulations.
stjam8-
McCarran- Ferguson Act of 1945 can be repealed by Congress!!
Congress can force the States to deregulate Insurance Companies so they can compete Interstate. It is in their constitutionally enumerated powers!
Why am I discussing this with you?
I freekin' GIVE UP!!
escomments: You are going to give up, just when we were having so much fun. Good luck on the Congress repealing anything that has to do with the insurance companies. If you want to see this repealed, then tell your legislators to vote for H R 1826, Fair Election Act.
Hahahaha! I couldn't have made up a better stereotypical ignorant right wing nutcase rant if I tried!
Are you for real, or just a liberal troll trying to make Neocons look like bigger idiots than they already do?
and here's the typical liberal response you were looking for gameon. Gary, go ahead....try. I dare ya.
Nah, I'll just stick to the "typical liberal responses" you love so much.
The neocons don't need any help looking like idiots, Gary. They do that all by themselves.
I rest my case gary.
Oh gosh. I'm a liberal, I don't smoke pot, I pay taxes, I've had a full-time jobe since I graduated, my parents raised me with extremely strict rules and everything I got I had to earn. I don't call people names and if you look back on these posts, you'll see that the rabid name-calling is mostly from conservatives.
And you, as an obvious conservative, first called the President of the United States the Fuhrer (who everyone knows refers to Hitler), then made outrageous broad statements about liberals, then accused the LIBERALS of not backing up their arguments. Then, you accuse the liberal posters of exactly what YOU are doing. Sad, really.
It is clear that this is your first time here. I've been on for months and the arguments put forth by the liberals are more concise, intelligent and polite than any coming from the conservs.
Did you "question" your government when Bush was President?
And where is your proof that these tea party people are business leaders, etc.?
I'm in the tea party and i am a business leader in my communtity,proof enough?And yes I questioned the liberal spending policies of Bush,it drove me out of the repub party. I'm still waiting for the shining example of a Gov. run anything that has been successful on a large scale,and don't waste my time with world war ll. When a business man like myself look to expand the powers of one of my employees we look to that employee's past to verify his/her "track record".Whats the Government's track record with managing money?You give examples of people being denied coverage by big ins.,but what do you think will happen when the inevitable Gov. mismanagement of health $ leads to prioritizing and rationoing of care?It doesn't take Nostradamus to see that your going to create a bigger problem than we have now.The only way to keep my individual freedoms is to leave health care in the free-market system where I spend my dollars where i like,with appropriate regs.That's why products go down in cost,more competition puts pressure on rising prices,this isn't debateable,it's just a fact.
People like me pay for the majority of services in this country and I demand that my tax money be spent responsibly!Most of the libs. responding I seriously doubt pay taxes like I do,it's just the statistics .It's much less important to non tax payers how the money is handled,just as long as you get yours from the "evil ,white ,businessmen.
Oh and amanda, this isn't my first time here ,I'm well aware of the level of intelligence and politeness in your posts.
I shouldn't call Pres. Obama the fuhrer,your right,i'm wrong.
ALL HAIL THE MESSIAH !!! THE CHOSEN ONE HAS RISEN,AND HE DEMANDS YOUR TAX MONEY!!! FALL IN LINE OR FACE THE WRATH OF THE OBAMANITES AND THEIR LEFTIST CABAL!!!!!!!!!
You probably won't look at this, but it's charts showing how much more we pay for health care than other industrialized nations.
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2009/11/an_insurance_industr y_ceo_expl.html
This has nothing to do with entitlements, it has nothing to do with giveaways.
I'm liberal, I work, and I have insurance that costs too much just like every insured person in this country.
another great post by Mr. Batchelor. This sorry spectacle that is what is left of the Republican party, ("undecipherable, unelectable, unmourned"), needs to be called out loudly by those who care about returning intelligence, integrity and responsible political dialogue to our culture. This group of media-mad dolts, like Bachmann as well as the alarmingly disingenuous, (and dishonest,) Boehner are not only bad for the GOP, they're bad for the country. And Newt is a little late to party in decrying the tactics he so helped foment back in the 90's. The foundations of all of this anti-government, take back the country, phony patriotism started in earnest with him.
JohnnyCakes, you are the genuine Patriot here.
Who do those Racist Republicans think they are fooling with their talk of freedom, virtue, and self reliance and how those character traits and attributes should be supported by Government, not destroyed by Government.
How freekin' crazy of them to espouse those views! What radicals!
No one in the world is self-reliant, you tool. Did you build the roads and bridges? Do you police your neighborhood? Do you put out your own fires? Do you monitor the weather for disaster preparedness? Do you develop your own medicatios? Do you see where I'm going?
artsyfartsy-
Let's see.... Simplistic, Shortsited, totally missed the point?
Am I going to build my own roads?
No, Can you find anyone, anywhere who would disagree that it is within the Governments purview to build roads?
Most of what you are using to base your arguments I am assuming would be State and Local Government as you haven't differentiated between those and Federal Government.
The Constitution even allows for the construction of the Interstate Highway system authorized by the Interstate Commerce Clause.
Am I going to police my own Neighborhoods?
Well that is debatable but for the most part, we have decided as a society that if we don't want everyone walking around armed with firearms we would hire a police department to do this for us so carrying firearms would not be necessary.
There again, can you find one person who would disagree that the Police department is a proper role of Government?
Fire Departments? I guess that would fall into local governments or even some communities actually pay dues to a community Fire Department to come to their property in the case of a fire.
Do they fight their own fires? Occasionally.
Once again, you probably wouldn't find a single person who would oppose that Fire Departments are a legitimate role of Government.
Same with monitoring the weather.
Pharmaceutical companies develop medications. Not the Government.
So much for where you were going.
What about where I was going?
What about since the Great Society, handing out billions upon billions of taxpayer money to people who refuse to work because they think they can game the welfare system? Generations upon generations of people on welfare. Hell, they don't even know any better. You almost can't blame them but you can sure as hell blame the Liberals and Big government for promoting that lifestyle.
How ironic. The Government creates the welfare state with big government programs and then puts itself in the position to be the one to fix it with.....You guessed it, more government programs.
As long as we always have this cycle of poverty, there will always be a need for Liberals and big government to be the antithesis of Freedom, Virtue, and Self Reliance!
Now we are moving right into the Super Bowl of Big Government:
Health Insurance Reform.
A pathetic cycle of depravity and the literal definition of insanity.
Of course as long as you have that cycle their will always be poverty
They definitely aren't self reliant and there is a prime example of the Government contributing to their non productiveness instead of supporting individual responsibility.
escomments: When every big business profits are threaten or mention some regulations to protect citizens from them, pull ou the old reliable bogyman, government take over. Or all those people on welfare[ most people work 2 or more jobs without any benefits]."pathetic cycle of depravity and the definition of insanity"
escomments: So bascially the status quo is just fine with you, continue letting big business take advantage of the working class? Insurance companies able to make large profits because they don't actually deliver health care when you need it . For many people the insurance premiums they pay for every month buys only a FALSE SENSE OF SECURITY!
Escomments, you are too articulate to be a genuine tea-bagger. Methinks you are a professional shit-disturber. I reckon some in that crowd are as well.
As for self reliance, I most definately prescribe to that. Earlier today I broke my leg. I have reset it on my own and am currently moldering bread in order to make antibiotics to stave off infections.
Nah, just kidding, I'm Canadian, we had this argument 40 years ago. We pay slightly higher taxes and are fully protected. I could not imagine the fear of folks that might get laid off, lose their coverage, then a leg, then their house, maybe even their life. This happens not from their own folly, but because Shit Happens.
You want to see insurection, trying getting Canadian's to adopt the American (un)System. There would be an election a month after the bill is indroduced.
Johnny cakes..johnny cakes...baker's man...make those cakes just as fast as you can....roll em up....roll em up......THROW 'EM IN THE PAN!!!!
see, i just ridiculed johnny without calling him names.
Artsyfartsy: Governments also spend to defend our country, but liberals don't like that much though do they? Gov't also has intellegence agencies that liberals are awfully fond of too, right? The point is where do we draw the line with what government should and should not be a part of. Where do they become intrusive? These are legitimate questions and concerns.
artsy - It's no use. They are so very frightened. They have been purposely misguided by their GOD's: The Bachmann's, Boehners, Palin's, Becks, Limbaugh's, etc.
Your retort to escomments was, as usual of the liberals on this post, right on.
how sadly ironic, those gathering on the capitol steps with their hate-filled, racist and violent signs, could not have seen the real face of violence from ft. hood.
rabble rabble rabble!!!!!
she is crazy.
Would somebody please tell me where this 10,000 number came from? If there were 10,000 fools at this event I'll grow wings and fly. A more accurate number is 3-4000. Not to mention a very large contingent of the anti-abortion crowd.
It came from Glenn Beck's University of I Don't Remember.
By tomorrow the number will be 2 million.
No doubt. It's already up to a million.
Becks over the top theatrics are pathetic. Bachman and Beck now theres a pair of clowns for ya!
The same place they came up with 1.3 mil nine-twelvers, In their demented minds ! I for one am ready to give them what they want !! You don't want healthcare ?? Fine you get no healthcare, Not now or anytime in the future, You want to be self sufficient ? Fine, Heal thy self fool, but lets be really self sufficient, Those public utilitys ?? Nope not for you ! Schools/ College ? Nope go read your bible and grab a copy of "Going Rogue " Streets and roads ? Nope not for you , saddle a horse or walk the woods are full of trails but beware for if you happen across my private property you will pay MY toll or be shot and thats dependent on IF I feel like gathering a toll that day ! Grocery stores ?? Oh no no !! Not for you , Get to planting I hear the winters going to be a rough one ! I really really hope that you have plenty of fur bearing animals on whatever property you can afford to barter for, Clothing is going to be mighty hard to come across being self sufficient and all , You want it ?? I'm ready to let you have it !!
so many balls so few mouths
So what else is new? The liberals are still calling everyone who doesn't agree with them stupid as more and more and more independents drift away from them. At what point will their brains kick in?
ThinkAgain: The issues are not being discussed. The republicans have delayed health care reform for monrhs. Barbara Boxer's committee on climate change is being boycotted by the republicans. This country has many serious problems that are not being dealt with. Republicans are important to solving these problems, they need to get involved in the process.
Global Warming is a hoax! Oh wait, you call it "Climate Change" now that the earth is actually cooling down. Yet another liberal power grab.
Tired of saying this ThinkAgain, but what's your point? Just more liberal-bashing and no points whatsoever. At least we HAVE brains to "kick in".
It is truly amusing when the tea-baggers quote Thomas Jefferson. Quotes attributed to Jefferson re: "periodic revolution is good for one's countries soul stuff" were derived from his work in France supporting the "socialistic" minded proletariat masses in their attempt to overthrow the bourgeoisie establishment. But what do you expect from people who call themselves teabaggers? To me it infers that the working class here in this country who do all the heavy lifting, have become eunuchs in some sad satirical way.
And since there is no viable third party, the Dems can suck really badly and still stay in power.
I totally agree. Given the current political climate, it seems we should actually have a four party system:
* Conservative Party
* Republican party
* Democratic Party
* Progressive Party
Though sadly, it seems we'll just end up with the same ineffectual two party system indefinitely
Thank you.
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